ursula kroeber leguin

topic posted Fri, September 23, 2005 - 1:00 PM by  offlineautomatthew
hey.

did you guys know that the k in ursula k leguin stands for kroeber?

have any of you read the word for world is forest?

just wanted to gush about how much i love her and how nice it was to find out that one of the main reasons she's so fabulous is because she was raised by an anthropologist.

i find science fiction in general to be anthropological, or should i say xenopological? especially in the construction of alien societies.

any other anthropology/scifi fanatics out there?
posted by:
automatthew
SF Bay Area
  • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

    Fri, September 23, 2005 - 3:40 PM
    I'm became a Le Guin fan when I read the Dispossessed as a teen. She's a nice person too, my friend was a cashier at the food co-op she shops at here in Portland and they often had little chats about activism and such. I haven't followed her more current writing but I've read most of her earlier Science fiction.

    I got into SF right after it was switching from hard to soft, moving from a physical sciences emphasis to a social sciences perspective. I'd even hazard that it influenced my choice of Anthropology as a major in college.
  • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

    Sat, November 5, 2005 - 3:07 AM
    Yep, i've been a sci-fi fan since I started knicking my dads Asimov and Lem books to read. I was an advanced reader so dad banned me from a collection of his books which made me even hungrier to read them. The story of O was also amongst the hidden horde but that's another story.

    Tolkien, Lem and Aldiss were all covered, he seriously favoured the old school and male authors. As I grew older and developed my own tastes Leguin came into the foray and I seriously fell in love...

    The funny thing is growing up I was considered weird for reading (a lot) and then to boot sci-fi to most people you couldn't get stranger than that... however I came to discover the sci-fi readers are the bomb. The best cultural analysts you could possibly come across simply because the material of the fiction fixated so much on stretching our social boundaries.

    Needless to say I ended up studying cultural anthropology at Uni. It all made sense when I read a definition; to paraphrase Ruth Benedict, that anthropologists by nature are social misfits. It was like a welcome home mama sign yipee I'd found my tribe.

    As I see it communication and understanding the social norms of a group are key to nigh on everything, if everyone had to study a tad of anthropology in their school life, I kid you not the world could be a hell of a better place. Not forgetting sci-fi the best boundary pushing literature in the universe.
    • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

      Tue, December 27, 2005 - 1:54 PM
      Ursula LeGuin reaches the full potential of science fiction and is my favorite author. I got hooked by the dispossesed, went to the Left Hand, then it was the Lathe of Heaven, then it was everything else I could dig up in several counties libraries.

      When I put together that she was raised by the man who chronicled the life of Ishi, things made sense. She's got such a vivid capacity for keeping the core of human nature intact while tweaking a variable here (gender) or there (social philosophy) or even over yonder (rotation of planet around its sun).

      While I fell in love with Ursula for her ability to transend social constructs and delve into the vary nature of the human condition, I must admit that her earlier work like the Earthsea novels are a real pleasure to read and have a timeless quality about them. Oh, but the Hainish world is so alluring. She commands such a strong sense of time. And she also sticks to the rules of evolution and biological and physical sciences that some authors only skirt around or take advantage of.

      One day I plan on baking her a pie and leaving it on her doorstep in Portland.



      There are a couple deacent biographies on her out there, but nothing really stunning.
      • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

        Tue, December 27, 2005 - 1:59 PM
        also she's just a brilliant writer. he prose is so beautiful. it flows so much better than most science fiction. it's so confident and complete if you know what i mean. it reads like legend.
        • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

          Tue, December 27, 2005 - 2:03 PM
          Like a legend. That's a good way of putting it. I get the sense that she could be a major influence in the "higher" genres of literature if she so chose. Have you read her poetry? I've read some, but it didn't really stick like her prose.
          • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

            Tue, December 27, 2005 - 4:27 PM
            she certainly could. she's one of the few science fiction writers that's as good at writing as she is at world building. there are very very few others. the only one i can think of off the top of my head is delaney. sturgeon too but he isn't really scifi.
            • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

              Tue, December 27, 2005 - 4:31 PM
              Who's delaney? Any top picks you recommend?
              • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

                Wed, December 28, 2005 - 12:56 AM
                oh! samuel r delaney. he's a GENIUS. literally. absolutely brilliant.

                probably a better writer than leguin. at least in an experimental stylistic way. with him it's very much about the writing, while with leguin it's more about the content/message and she just happens to be very very good at writing.

                his masterwork is dhalgren. it's a huge tome of about 800 pages about a city cut off in space, time, and logic in the middle of america. fires burn indefinately without fuel or sound. the sun suddenly appears 1000 times it's normal size. two moons shine at night and then disappear. but people can wander in and sometimes out. but not all people. and inside some peoples experiences don't match up at all with others. time shifts, weeks are lost. it's an experiment in subjectivity gone wild. it's weeeeird. and not exactly science fiction.

                he does have real science fiction though that is equally good but on a smaller scale. the jewels of aptor is very good. the ballad of beta-2 is very good, and also very anthropological. heh. babel-17 is very good and also very anthropological. nova. stars in my pockets like grains of sand. and also his short stories, like time considered as a helix of semi-precious stones. a good collection is called aye, and gomorrah.

                incidentally he's gay and black. his neveryon series brings in the gay bit but is more "fantasy" than scifi. but it's not really fantasy. it's more of an imagined prehistory. and in that sense is also rather anthropological. prehistorical fiction in an imagined place that could have existed but isn't connected to any actual place.
      • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

        Tue, December 27, 2005 - 7:27 PM
        I ran across The Dispossesed when I was about 15, after reading a whole lot of Philip K. Dick, and Dostopian/Utopian stuff by the likes of Orwell and Huxley.

        It really got me thinking, questioning power, thinking about social theory in human terms. Where politics cross cultural anth have facinated me ever since.

        Oh, and Dick fueled my teen angst and got my into psycedelics.
        • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

          Wed, December 28, 2005 - 12:56 AM
          phillip k dick would be the other scifi writer who's actually a very good serious writer.

          vonnegut is another if you think of him as scifi. sometimes he can be rather scifish.
      • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

        Wed, December 28, 2005 - 12:18 PM
        " she was raised by the man who chronicled the life of Ishi"

        That woman, not man. It was her mother, Theodora, who worked with and wrote about Ishi.

        Bob
        • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

          Wed, December 28, 2005 - 3:27 PM
          Is that so? I seem to recall that the Kroeber elders were a bit of a team, but I didn't realize that it was 'ole mum who worked closely with Ishi. Thinking about it now, I wonder how much the exposure to Ishi influenced Ursula. She is so obsessed with themes of exile, the stranger in the strange land, finding a way to get home, etc. that must have been so physicalized by Ishi, himself...
          • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

            Thu, December 29, 2005 - 8:02 AM
            It was certainly Theodora who wrote it up etc. They were a team. Ishi lived with them, more or less. Had to have had a big effect on little Ursula.

            Bob
            • Re: ursula kroeber leguin

              Mon, January 9, 2006 - 10:58 AM
              ever read her latest book? 'changing planes'... little pearls of pure genial fantasy. reminds me of one of the most important italian writers, italo calvino, who is, not accidentally, one of legiun's favourite writers... what is strange (or not?) is that he's not considered a science fiction writer, although he might be one. if you, us readers, would like to go in a library and find out if there's some translation of calvino (there surely is), i suggest you, from the other side of the ocean, 'le cosmicomiche' rather than 'se una notte d'inverno un viaggiatore'...
              although he was a great writer and a great man i still have to say that no one ever helped me to define my perception of the world as leguin did...one day i'll have to thank her.

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